ininteract with c cabenuva. seriouous side effffects ince allelergic reactctions postst-injectionon reactio, liver prproblems, and depresession. allelergic reactctions postst-injectionon reactio, if y you have a a rash and or allelergic reactction sympto, stop cababenuva and d get medidical help r right a. tellll your doctctor if you e liver prproblems stop cababenuva and d get medidical help r right a. or menental healthth conce, and if y you are preregnan, stop cababenuva and d get medidical help r right a. breaeastfeeding,g, or consisidering preregnanc. stop cababenuva and d get medidical help r right a. some of f the most c common e effects s include stop cababenuva and d get medidical help r right a. injectction-site r reactio, fefever, and t tiredness.. if y you switch h to caben, attend a all treatmtment appoinintmen. if y you switch h to caben, ready to t treat your r hiv in a a differentnt way? if y you switch h to caben, ask k your doctotor about every-otheher-month cacabenu. if y you switch h to caben, withth every-othther-month cabenuva,, i'm good t to go. withth every-othther-month cabenuva,, ♪♪ this sunday, age old problem. >> we now have to finish the onand there's more to do. >> after officially launching his 2024 campaign focusing on donald trump, president biden dismisses concerns about his

age. >> i can't even say the number. it doesn't register with me. >> the idea that he would make it until 86 years old is not -- is not something that i think is likely. >> meanwhile, donald trump keeps his focus biden and the general election. >> he is grossly incompetent, has no idea what he's doing. >> are biden and trump in a co-department relationship? do they need each other in order to succeed in 2024? i'll talk to vivek ramaswamy, a republican entrepreneur running for the nomination. >> disney versus desantis. disney sues governor ron desantis accusing him of retaliating against the company. >> i don't think the suit has merit. i think it's political. >> republicans are distancing themselves from the issue as the battle escalates. >> i do worry if this happens too many times businesses that are thinking about coming to florida are thinking maybe we don't want to go there. >> and border surge. the biden administration are

bracing for a potential wave of migrants when the covid era policy ends in two weeks. >> it will not be open after may 11th. >> this is irresponsible. will bidden's new policy mack a difference? i'll speak to alejandro mayorkas. >> trying to honor his legacy. luke russert his written a new book about how he dealt with sudden loss of his dad sdwloo joining me for insight, yamiche alcindor. former democratic senator from missouri, claire mccaskill, nbc news capitol hill correspondent ryan nobles and lanhee chen, a fellow at the hoover institution. welcome to sunday, it's "meet the press". >> from nbc news in washington, the long of-running show in television history, this is "meet the press" with chuck todd. a good sunday morning.

it was ten years ago this very month that the so-called gang of eight rolled out an immigration reform pan that they believed could finally pass congress. >> we all wish we didn't have this problem, but we do and we have to fix it because leaving things the way they, that's the real am nest. >> i think 2013 is the year of immigration reform. >> it was not and the laws haven't changed. donald trump would launch his political campaign building his entire identity with the issue of being tough on immigration and tough on the worder. decided to wall off the southern border and while the wall didn't materialize the deterrence at the border instituted policies that included separating migrant children from their parents and instituting the remain in mexico program which sent migrants back to mexico while seeking u.s. asylum. biden endorsed a sweeping immigration plan on his very first day in office, but the plan went nowhere even though

democrats controlled both houses of congress at the time instead the immigration criticized a transit ban which would force some migrants to apply for asylum from their home countries. as biden runs for a second term the immigration issue which he never mentioned this week continues to be one of his toughest will cha efrjes. in 2021, more migrants crossed the southern border more than any year since 1960 and in 2022 the record was broken again. in two weeks title 42 that has aloud both the biden and trump administrations that expelled most migrants since march 2020 allegedly to prevent the spread of covid will expire and the u.s. relationship with mexico, the government, that is, has perhaps never been war with the cooperation of the drug war at the lowest point, fentanyl with

chemicals sourced from china is now the leading cause of death for americans between the ages of 18 and 49 from our friends from "the washington post." the biden administration announced new steps to stem the migration including opening new centers in guatemala, creating a new program, and alejandro mayorkas acknowledged there would be a border surge, but he also said it does not mean more migrants should come. >> this propaganda is false. let me be clear. our border is not open and will not be open after may 11th. >> and secretary mayorkas joins me now. welcome back to "meet the press". >> good morning, chuck. >> before i start on this there's been a horrific execution-style shooting down in texas. authorities are now searching and there's a man hunt for someone who is armed and

dangerous. i know you've been monitoring this. dhs is monitoring this, what can you tell us about the alleged suspect francisco oropeza. >> i can assure you that law enforcement will deliver accountability. the case is an active one under investigation and i can't comment further. >> there is a question about his citizenship. he supposedly had -- they refer to it as a consulate card from mexico meaning he was here legally, but perhaps he'd overstayeded? >> chuck, i won't comment on it because it is an active case. the tragedy that occurred, you described it correctly just absolutely horrific. our hearts go to the victims, the victims' families, those children and we'll deliver accountability. >> doey woo know if federal authorities are involved besides fbi and local authorities and is your team involved? border patrol at all? >> we are monitoring the situation carefully and the fbi

is the lead investigative agency and working with the locals there. let me move to the announcement and what's coming in life after 42. there is already reports of brownsville, texas, right now, shelters are overwhelmed. chicago and new york are overwhelmed and what is it going to look like before the expiration of title 42? >> a few things, chuck. first of all, this is a tough challenge and has been as wye recognize for years and years. we are seeing a level of migration not just the southern border, but throughout the hemisphere that is unprecedented. it is the great of the migration in our hemisphere since world war ii. the president on day one delivered a solution. he delivered immigration reform legislation that we had hoped congress would act on swiftly. they haven't. within the constraints of a broken immigration system we are

doing so much. our approach is to build lawful pathways and cut out the ruthless smugglers and deliver lawful pathways so people can access humanitarian relief without having to take the dangerous journey from their own countries and at the same time if they arrive at our southern border in between ports of entry we will deliver consequences. >> all right. i want to go through specific scenarios, an unaccompanied minor that comes on may 12th, what happens? >> we follow the law. the law provides that we take custody of that child and we have 72 hours within which to transfer that unaccompanied child to the department of health and human services and then it is for the department of health and human services, hhs, to identify a relative, a sponsor in the united states to whom they can transfer care of that child. >> do you accept the idea that that is all considereded a loophole to get into the

country? >> chuck, we have to take a look at the humanitarian issue here. these are parents that are suffering such desperation when it's by reason of an authoritarian regime, tremendous violence, acute poverty, persecution that they are so desperate that they send their children to the southern border alone. we have, the law provides humanitarian relief for these children and we enforce that law. >> if a family comes to the border and if they've not done this pre-filing and not filed for an asylum plan what happens to a family with children under the age of 18? >> so we will exercise our enforcement authorities in a tradition immigration context. remember, title 42 is a public health authority and not an immigration authority that was delivered in response to the covid-19 pandemic.

when that ends on may 11th, we will use our immigration authorities under title 8 of the united states code. that family will be placed in immigration enforcement proceedings, removal proceedings. they will make a claim, if they make a claim for relief, we will adjudicate that claim for relief swiftly. >> define swiftly. >> it could be days or weeks. it is not going to be months. >> because we've seen in new york migrants are getting court dates in 2033. how does that happen? >> what we have done now is we are going to be able to exercise our immigration enforcement authorities. we've been precluded from doing so by a court. we sought to end title 42 long ago and title 42 does not deliver an immigration consequence. title 8 of the united states code does. if an individual is removed under title 8, they will

encounter an at least five-year bar on re-admission into the united states. >> here's a question i have. there are 2 million asylum cases in the backlog right now. what happens to new asylum claims on may 12th? do they get put in line behind these 2 million cases? this is why the quick adjudication. i get it in theory, how is it going to work in practice when we are sitting on 2 million case backloggeded? >> we will focus on recent border crosses, but the point, the fundamental point is we have more than 2 million cases in an immigration backlog that has been building year over year over year. what a powerful example of a completely broken immigration system. we have got to fix it. we need legislative reform. >> what is a -- i've gone through this before. i know there's a comprehensive aspect that we need, but just border enforcement you need more

money for what? you need more processing centers in country? besides columbia and guatemala, do you want to open centers in honduras? could you even open a center in venezuela or would a government allow us to do that? >> chuck, we need resources for it all, but remember, the resources will enable us to move more quickly, more efficiently within a broken immigration system. so i just want to be clear that we are working within significant constraints. we need people. we need technology, we need facilities. we need transportation resources, all of the elements of addressing the needs of a large population of people arriving irregularly in our southern border. >> what's the definition of a secure border to you? >> it is in the context in which we are working, it is maximizing the resources that we have available to us to deliver the

most effective results and something that is overlooked and that i speak about frequently is the fact that our apprehension rate at our southern border are consistent with the apprehension rates in the prior administration. and why is that? it is because of the extraordinary, and extraordinarily heroic work of the united states border patrol, but it is enormous. >> i want to ask you about the border patrol because the union doesn't like you and they made it very clear this month and last month and this is all first border patrol. the chickens will come under roost because of what he's done. remove mayorkas was their most recent tweet. how do you lead a group whose union wants you out of office? >> am proud to work with the border patrol and i've supported them vigorously since my first day in office and i will continue to do so.

a tremendous source of pride. >> what do you think the disconnect is? is this media perception? is this a red/blue divide? just simply that you're in a democratic administration? >> chuck, i'm focused on mission. that's what i'm focused on. i look at their need. i try to fulfill their needs. upon we go to congress and seek support. this is the first administration since 2011 that has plussed up the border patrol with more agents. our request of congress for fiscal year 2024 is another 350 border patrol agents and that hasn't happened for over 12 years. >> let's talk about the fentanyl issue. the biggest impediment in dealing with the fentanyl issue, is it americans' addiction? is it the mexican government's inability or frankly passe relationship with the cartels or is it the fact that china so easily exports these materials? what's the toughest aspect in

this? >> chuck, it's a matter of supply and a matter of demand no different than the scourge of drugs that has afflicted this country for decades. i will tell you, i was a federal prosecutor for 20 years. i prosecuted methamphetamine cases and black tar heroin and we haven't seen anything like fentanyl. its toxicity, these cartels are peddling in death and destruction, but we have to stop the flow of fentanyl and we also have to address the demand. >> in the '80s we covertly worked with the colombian government to deal with cartels in colombia and we had success. is it time to deal and i know some people are calling for more direct military confrontation with cartels or call them terrorist organizations and is it time to call for a strategy that we did similar to the colombian cartels? >> number one, we are taking it

to the cartels with unprecedented strength and focus. there is a misperception that mexico is not a good partner in our fight against -- >> is that an ally or not? they don't act like an ally these days. >> they are an ally. >> how come they don't help on the fentanyl stuff? >> that is a misconception, we have transnational criminal investigations units and they're in mexico. >> amlo denies it in un. lick that they're having anything to do with fentanyl traffic. >> chuck, i can't speak to his public statements. i can speak through what happens on the ground, operationally and we work very closely with our mexican partners and that fentanyl, though, the precursor chemicals and the equipment used to manufacture it, much of it originates in china and we've got to stop that flow. >> what is a good way to do that? of course, our relationship with

china is not very positive. we are working with our mexican authorities and we are working with our partners internationally to put pressure on china, to interdict the flow and to identify the transport companies, to cut off the finances and to hold individuals and companies accountable. >> i want to ask you, you're in cabinet meetings and there are a lot of questions about presidented bien and his ability to serve in his second term. you've seen him face to face, what say you? is he up for a second term? >> oh, chuck, 100%. incredibly sharp and incredibly probing and incredible command on the details and probing on the details and asking tough questions, absolutely. i'm incredibly proud to serve in his administration. i am incredibly proud of the work this we have done across the border. >> your full he can serve, secretary? >> 100%. >> secretary mayorkas, a big

task ahead of you. >> we look forward to it. >> when we c mass general brigham -- when you need some of the brightest minds in medicine. this is a leading healthcare system with five nationally ranked hospitals, including two world-renowned academic medical centers. in boston, where biotech innovates daily and our doctors teach at harvard medical school and the physicians doing the world-changing research are the ones providing care. ♪♪ there's only one mass general brigham. (v(vo) rered lobster'r's finer r poinf fun didining: ♪♪ the correcect answer t to startr entreeee is who giveves a shrimpmp, when yot bothth. introducucing new dodockside d. get anan individuaual-size star anand entree f for just $1$15.. welcome e to fun dinining. (cececily) yoyou're looooking pleasased h yourselflf. (s(seth) nonot to brag,g, but i i just switctched to vere. (c(cecily) soso you got a an awesome e net. (seth) and when i i switched,d, i gogot to choosose the phononei wantnted. for frfree. not brbra.

(c(cecily) yoyou're braragging. (n(neighbor) oh, he''s braggiging. (s(seth) whwho, me? nevever. oh, exexcu. hello, youour royal hihighnes, sir... (cecilily) okayay, that's a brag.. (seth) hehey, mom. i i gotta callll yo. (vo) swititch and chohoose the phphou want, likeke the increredible iphoe 14, , on us. (cecilily) on t the networkrk worth bragging a about. veririzon theyey'll be e here in 5,5,e reready? therere's uh.... oh. wewe'll just p put books h h. anand that looooks fine. ththat's bad. . there we g . ooo! thahat's no gooood. i can jujust cover i it. yeah. can n you do that the w whole day?? that wororks. - not t a big dealal. - i i can't stopop, i can't t . i dodon't have i it, i don'n't have it.t. leleft. left.. - kekeep going.. - eeyah.h. it's pererfect. we shoululd've used d behr. yeahah. today y let's papaint, spray, anand stain wiwith behr, america's s most trusted papaint brand.d. wawas the frididge here bebef? - yes. - no. behr. exclusivelely at the h home de.

welcome back. as america debates how old is too old to be president, the youngest candidate that's announced in the 2024 field is currently introducing himself to voters. vivek ramaswamy is a 37-year-old multimillionaire graduated from yale high school. he made his fortune in biotech and ran an asset management company that calls itself anti-woke. a first-time candidate, he plans to start an anti-woke cultural movement. >> we're in the middle of a national identity crisis. that leaves a vacuum in its wake and when you have a vacuum that runs that deep that is what poison fills the void. pick your favorite one, wokism,

transgenderism, climatism, covidism. >> and vivek ramaswamy joins me now. mr. ramaswamy, welcome back. welcome to sunday "meet the press". >> thank you. good to see you again, chuck. let me start with this look, you have anti-wokism and this is your political identity as you've introduced yourself to folks. i get it in the primary. why are you convinced that this message can work if you have the nomination in the general election. >> i think it's true for all americans. we are all hungry for a cause here in america. we are hungry for purpose and means at a point when the things that used to fill our hunger for purpose, patriotism, family, hard work, these things have disappeared. so i see an opportunity to revive our missing national identity. i think that's something that americans hunger for across the political spectrum, answering what it means to be an american today. you ask people my age that

question you get a blank stare in response. that is the vacuum at the heart of the national soul. i'm running for president to revive the ideals that actually set the nation into motion, and i think that will unite the country. >> it's interesting. your rhetoric can sound uniting and your answer just now, but then you say the following thins. the trans movement has become a cult. we need it abandon climate religion in america and i find the idea of systemic racism revolting and how do you square those statements with unification. these are divisive times. this is a polarizing time. we are pretty evenly divided on these cultural issues and how do you unite the country when you're essentially denigrating the views of half the country. >> i don't think i'm denigrating the views of half the country and let's take the touchiest of the subjects right now, the trans issue. i think when a child is born and says my gender does not match my

sex. that doesn't mean you disrespect that person. that is a cry for help. i met with two women going through hysterectomies and chemical intervention and teaching kids when you're struggling inside going through adolescence yes, that involves some struggle and we live in a country where adults are affirming that. >> do you talk to parents who have a kid going through this. >> yes. it's a difficult place to be. i acknowledge that. what we need to do is act with compassion and what makes us feel good about ourselves and that is my main issue across the issue like climate, and solving the actual underlying issues rather than what allows you to signal your virtue. >> what makes it compassionate, though, to pass a law that denies a parent making their own health care decision for their kid. that doesn't sound very

conservative and small government. >> there isn't a state in the union that allows you to smoke a cigarette before the age of 18 and get a tattoo, and a body-altering change that a kid may regret later in life. after 18 years old and you are free to do whatever you want to and that's what it means to live in a free country and we won't allow chemical castration through puberty blockers. >> how do you know? are you confident that you know that gender is as binary as you're describing it? are you confident? >> i am. >> do you know this as a scientist? >> there are two x chromosomes if you're a woman and an x and a y. >> there is a lot of scientific research that says gender is a spectrum. >> i respectfully disagree, it has been characterized as a mental disorder and i don't think it's compassionate, it's

krult pep when a kid is crying out for help you have to ask what else is going wrong at home? what else is going wrong at school and let's be compassionate and get to the heart of that rather than play the game rather than changing the medical understanding. >> i go back to this, if a parent is dealing with a child that may have these issues, trust me, the parent -- the last thing they want to do is consider something like this, but if that is what they think could help their child pursue happiness or not to kill themselves, i -- why take away that option? again, why shouldn't it be up to the parent? >> part of why parents suddenly now feel that way is we've created a culture that teaches parents that they're being bigoted or bad people if they don't actually take those steps. so part of what i think -- listen, gender disforria is a condition of suffering. my question is why on earth are we going out of our way to create more of it and there's no doubt that the cultural movement

in the country is creating more gender disforria if it's a condition of suffering, let's not create more. >> let me ask you about the disney with ron desantis. on one hand, i agree with pushing back on disney the way desantis has rhetorically, but is there a point when you think it's too much to use government to punish business? >> here's where ron desantis lost it here? he's gone on the wrong path. he claimed and this part actually sounded good to me. disney should have never had crony capitalist lobbying in the first place. here's the part he didn't mention. one of those crony capitalist privileges and the most relevant one was codified into law by none other than ron desantis in 2021. so florida passed this political antidiscrimination statute which i applauded at the time, which if you operated streaming companies like disney does that you can't discriminate. they wrote a last-minute

exemption for anyone who operates a theme park more than 25 acres in the state of florida. that's crony capitalist and the irony is ron desantis who is rolling that back was the one who actually passed that into law for the case of disney. so i think that undermines the credibility of his crusade. i prefer to get to root causes rather than do political stunts. >> let me ask you about the idea of cancel culture because i feel like the criticism that the right was making of the left two years ago that it looks like some on the right are embracing cancel culture. bud light, the transgender representative in montana who was kicked on on not allowed to speak on the floor, do you think some of this is going too far? >> i'm a -- cancel culture and victimhood. i do think the way the culture war ends is not with a bang, but with a whimper where both sides get affected by the same norms. >> do you think the right has been affected.

>> we have to be the party of free speech and open debate and not the party of i'm here talking to you on nbc. there are other candidates on in the race who say they won't talk to nbc news. ron desantis is one of them. i go to college campuses. we have to practice what we preach, i'm in the race as a millennial, as a young person who lives the american dream to walk the walk when it comes to free speech and yes, i would like to see other candidates rise to the occasion and do better this fall. >> if donald trump doesn't do debates will you not support him if he's not the nominee. >> i won't let him get away with it. >> what do you mean. he can do what he wants to do. >> i think others like donald trump will relish being on the stage. what people gave him credit for was that he is an outsider and disruptor and i'm the outsider and if you want to be like joe biden in existing establishment that doesn't want to debate. >> what should the party use as

leverage to show him to show up? >> think it's the voters and it's my job and the job of candidates that if you want someone sitting across the table from xi jinping and someone with a spine to take on the state at the top of the agenda, you better not be scared to show up on the debate stage with donald trump. >> you would support a six-week abortion ban if governor of the state. what would you do on a federal level? would you create a floor? >> i believe in being principled and i'm unapologetically pro-life and i believe it is a form of murder. murder is regulated by the states and not by the federal government. i believe in the constitution. i believe roe was wrongly decided and this is a matter for the states and not the federal government. >> when does a fetus have constitutional rights? >> six weeks at the end of life when you lose brain waves and that's our moment of death. >> where in the constitution says someone has constitutional

rights as a fetus. >> it's not codified in the constitution and that's why it's a matter for the states and i do believe that i'm unapologetically pro-life and one of the ways we can do better is to walk the walk. provide a way for women to get to yes, i support adoption, child care and greater responsibility for men and that's how we turn this issue from being a device of one. >> one that's a head scratcher is defund the fbi. >> i think it's a new apparatus that respects the law instead of making it up. the funny thing -- >> do you think the fbi constantly making up the law. that say huge law. they have just have been able to get -- there is a lot of work the fbi does other than respond to complaints from elected officials who don't like investigations. >> if you look over the course of the last 60 years, j. edgar

hoover what he did to martin luther king isn't a front. it's still the j. edgar hoover fbi that people walk down the street in washington, d.c., and i personally believe that people who run the executive branch of the government when you have a bureaucracy whose culture bes some sos on phied every once in a while you need to turn it over and yes, you need law enforcement and that institution has become so ossified in its corruption that we need to build it from scratch. >> so you will replace the fbi with a new fbi? >> a new institution to carry out the federal law enforcement because the existing fbi and the people who worked there have worked there are if so long that they'll be getting in their own way is important. >> it does sound like you're just replacing the fbi with the fbi. >> the problem is there are people who worked there for decades and if i'm the u.s. president and i can't work for the government for more than eight years which is a good

thing then none the bureaucrats should either pf vivek ramaswamy, we'll be following it. good to share your views with us. our meet the press minute when president biden reannounced his campaign his age immediately became the issue. biden would be 82 if he were to win. trump would be 78, second oldest president ever elected. the average age of the president at the start of the first term is 55. back in 1975 then-president gerald ford who was 62 at the time, mind you, talked about the role age played in his own upcoming election. >> here we are looking at 76 and most of the meeting candidates are geezers like me in their 60s. now we seem to have misplaced a generation here somewhere. is the system out of phase? what explains this? >> i think age is a state of mind, obviously, a state of health. i'm in the early 60s.

i feel vigorous mentally and physically as i have at any time in my life. i don't think you should rule a person out just because of their -- my particular age, on the other hand, i don't think you should rule out a younger person who, by experience or intelligence or overall capability is a potential candidate. >> that was 48 years ago. when we come back, it's an when we come back, it's an extremely what if buildings could tell you how ththey could b be more effffic? i'm listenening. wellll, with ibmbm, yoyou can use e software to help p you connecect anand analyze e data— from h hvacs to elelevators to ligights. whatat if we usese ai-dririven insighghts to pinpopoint ineffificiency? yep. a and act on n it. sasaving energrgy, money.... .... and emisissions. yup.p. that's a a big one. now w you've buiuilt somethig bebetter for e everyone. ththat's the s sustainabilily solution i ibm anand a globalal real estate cocompany creaeated.

what will l you createte? ibm. l let's creatate. meet the o outdoorsieses. wayfair's outdoorr dealal experts.. what will l you createte? the gardrdener... goes to o wayfair fofor gagardening babasics that.t. arenen't so b basic. the e entertainener... heher place mimight lolook expensisive. dodon't let t it fool yoyo. anand me, the loungeger... i get justst what i need with h a tap on the wayayfair app.. get ououtdoorsy fofor way y less at wawayfair. ♪ wayayfair, you'u've got t just what t i need ♪ my a1c1c was up hehere; nonow, it's dodown with ryrybe. his a1a1c? it's dowown with rybybelsus®. my doctor r told me ryrybelsu® lowewered a1c bebetter ththan a leadiding brandeded l and that people takaking rybelslsus® lostst more weigight. i i got to my y a1c goal and lostst some weigight too. rybelsusus® isn't f for peope with t type 1 diababetes. don't tatake rybelsusus®

if you or r your familily everd medullllary thyroioid cancer, or havave multiplele endocrie neoplalasia syndrorome type , oror if allergrgic to it.. stop rybybelsus® and get memedical helplp right y ifif you get a a lump or swellining in your r neck, severe s stomach paiain, or an n allergic r reaction. serious siside effectsts may ininclude pancncreatitis. gallblbladder proboblems may o . tell youour providerer about vision proroblems or c change. takiking rybelsusus® wiwith a sulfofonylurea or ininsulin incrcreases low wd sugar risksk. siside effectsts like nausus, vovomiting, and diarrhrhea may lelead to dehyhydration, which may y worsen kikidney problblems. neneed to get t your a1c d d? yoyou may pay y as little e a0 per prescription. my dad was a hard worker. he used to do side jobs installing windows, chararging sometething lilike a hundrdred bucks a a w when otherer guys were chargrging four toto five-hundndred bucks.. he just t didn't wananna do t. hehe was proudud of the price hehe was chargrging. ♪♪ my dad i instilled i in me, always put the people before the money. be proud of offeringng a good product at a fair price. i i think he'd'd be extremey prproud of me,e, yeah. ♪♪

welcome back. the panel is here. nbc news washington correspondent yamiche ail sindhor. ryan nobles, lanhe chen, fellow at the institution and claire mccaskill. yamiche, when we saw the announcement video from joe biden it was not about what he did. it felt like it is about who he's running against again and it felt very much almost like -- and even referenced the first video. he really needs donald trump to

be the nominee and donald trump responded this thursday by focusing on him. are they in a co-dependent relationship? >> there is definitely benefits to having both of those men run against each other in both of their minds and i also think democrats are coming to the realization that the culture war is that democrats should be robustly talking about because their voters are mobilized by that. january 6th abortion and then we got into book banning and having talked to voters and democrats are worried about their own freedoms and i want to wrestle that word back from republicans and you see joe biden in the video making that case and making sure that people say, okay, you might have done something for the inflation and the bills, but your life is at stake and i think there's fear, frankly, that's leaned into there which you also saw on the republican side. >> what's interesting to me is on your beat in congress you're seeing members in each party start to focus on the other. politically for us, it's helpful

if former president trump is front and center. then you look at republicans dave carney, biden is an easy target and wesley hunt, two more years of there and i am more and more confident every day. it is fascinating that both sides think the other guy is -- >> you set the stage saying the only person that can beat this candidate is this guy and the only guy that can beat this candidate is the other guy and it does seem in many ways that's what this presidential campaign is shaping up to be. the polls -- the poll that we just conducted this week shows pretty clearly that most americans do not want to see either of these two guys at the top of the ticket right now, but we're in a situation where there aren't clear alternatives and if you go back to having this conversation if it's not president biden who is it? his stranglehold on the republican base which i see every single day particularly in the house of representatives is

so strong the idea that there would be some sort of republican alternative in a serious way right now just doesn't appear to be that clear. >> claire, if trump weren't there, would there be more democratic hand wringing? >> oh, i don't know. i don't think so. would joe biden run no matter what? yes, he would. inflation is down 40%. he's created more jobs than almost any president in the history of our country. he got the infrastructure bill through that donald trump kept talking about for weeks and weeks on end. so he has accomplishments, and i think he enjoys the job, and i think he would run no matter what. no question, but this is another thing, chuck that people forget. this is never a referendum. presidential elections by the time they come around, who do you like slicely better than the two you don't like? >> right. >> it is a binary choice and even if it's not trump extremism

is on the ballot this time around, whether they like it or not? it's a choice referendum. i always like to say that and both of the times this century, claire is right, it's been the case. lahneee, i don't think they're interested in having a primary, do you? >> it doesn't feel that way right now. it's funny because we're pretty late in the primary cycle, but it still feels early. >> people will say that. it's early. it's not. >> the reality of it is i think the way this field, the way that this contest is shaping up, it's pretty clear, people realize it will be one ticket against trump, trump will be there at the end of the day and the question is who will the other person be? governor haley and governor desantis and you are starting to see people go after ron desantis because they perceive, listen, there is an opportunity to be that other voice against donald trump when we get to early next year. >> i guess, but boy, ron desantis, you now have republicans almost universally

criticizing his handling of the disney thing and there are an array of republicans critiquing him. >> i don't think building a prison next to the place that you bring your family is the best idea. >> i do worry if this happens too many times businesses that are thinking about coming to florida are saying maybe we don't want to go there. >> if disney wants to move their hundreds of thousands to south carolina, i'll let them know. i'll be happy to meet them. >> i don't agree how disney has handled things, but you don't use the heavy hand of government to punish a business. >> ryan, the number two candidate is getting the pile on right now and not the front-runner. >> i talked to desantis advisers about this and there is a recognition about how he's being pillared right now by not just republicans, but democrats as well and what they're saying is just wait for him to get in the race. he's amassing a huge war chest right now both within a super pac and he has the ability to raise a lot of money as a candidate himself, and so their

feeling is until he's actually a candidate we really shouldn't be overstating the difficulty that he's having in this early part of the campaign. >> yamiche, was there a former florida governor who had so much money that was going to be a huge factor in 2015. how did that work out? >> famous last name. that didn't work out very well and when you look at ronny did santis and i've talked to conservatives about this, going to war with disney, not only does it look petty and small, but you're also going after a huge employer of blue collar people who will be your base voters and disney is telling employees, this is a problem and here is the person that will make your life hard. it will be hard for ron desantis. >> is this over before this begins? i know no one wants to say it, but it smells rough. >> it's not by him getting in the race. the question is these primary contests are sort of battles of attrition and infrastructure building and all of the stuff that doesn't get covers, he has the money to be able to compete

in a way that people need to pay attention still. look, the last couple of weeks have been uneven and that's not what i pay attention to. >> claire, barack obama was in this position against hillary clinton, maybe he's not going to get there. do you see similarities or do you think desantis is in a different spot? >> you cannot compare desantis to people who have been tested on a national stage like hillary clinton and barack obama. this guy is not ready and he declared war and doesn't know what victory is against mickey mouse. give me a break. >> when we come back, our latest >> when we come back, our latest nbc - you like that bone? i got a great price on it. - did you see my tail when that chewy box showed up? - oh, i saw it. - sorry about the vase. - can we just say vase like normal people? - fine. - i always wondered what it would be like to have a tail. - maybe you did one time. and maybe a thousand years from now, i'll be tail-less using that chewy app to get you great prices on treats. - i'm pretty sure it takes more than a thousand years- - vase. - pets aren't just pets. they're more. - vase!

- [announcer] save more on what they love with everyday great prices at chewy. (air whooshing) (box thudding) detect this: living w with hiv, detect this: i i learned i i can stay undndetectabe wiwith fewer medidicines. i i learned i i can stay undndetectabe that's whyhy i switched t to dovat. dovato i is for someme adultso are ststarting hiviv-1 treret or replacicing their c currt hiv-1 1 regimen. dedetect this:s: no otherer completee hihiv pill dedetect this:s: uses fewerer medicines toto help keepep you undedetectable thanan dovato. uses fewerer medicines toto help keepep you dedetect this:s: momost hiv pilills containn

3 or 4 4 medicineses. dodovato is as efeffective wiwith ju. reresearch shohows people e whe hiv trtreatment asas prescrid and geget to and s stay undedetectable reresearch shohows people e whe hiv trtreatment asas prescrid can nono longer trtransmit hihiv through h sex. don't takeke dovato ifif youe allergic t to its s ingredie, or if yoyou take dofofetili. don't takeke dovato ifif youe allergic t to its s ingredie, taking d dovato withth dofetie can cacause seriouous or lifife-threatenening side effffects. taking d dovato withth dofetie can cacause seriouous hepatititis b can bebecome har to trereat while o on dova. dodon't stop d dovato withtht talklking to youour doct, asas your hepapatitis b mamay n dodon't stop d dovato withtht talklking to youour doct, or becomome life-thrhreateni. seriouous or life-e-threateng side e effects canan occ, or becomome life-thrhreateni. including g allergic r reacti, lactic a acid buildudup, and liliver problelems. ifif you have e a rash or r or alallergic reaeaction sympmpt, and liliver problelems. stop d dovato and liliver problelems. and get t medical hehelp right t away. and liliver problelems. tell y your doctoror if you hae kidneyey or liver r proble, or i if you are,e, may be, or plan toto be pregnanant. dovavato may hararm your u unborn babyby. use e effective e birth contl whilile on dovatato. do n not breastftfeed whilile taking d dovato. use e effective e birth contl whilile on dovatato. momost common n side effeces are headacache, nauseaea, diarrheaea, trouble e sleepi, tirednesess, and anxnxiety. momost common n side effeces are headacache, nauseaea, detetect this: i stay undndetectable e with fer memedicines.

asask your dococtor abat switchining to dovata. ♪♪ ♪♪ welcome back. data download time. as we head into 2024, the culture wars are dominating the conversation right now as we continue to debate what kind of country we should become and how quickly that change should happen. numbers from our most recent nbc news poll suggests the nation is pretty open to social change and that possibly could give democrats an advantage with some of these cultural issues among the national electorate. let me show you what i'm talking

about here. do we need to do more to increase social justice and this is a popular expression of support overall and 70% of americans agree with that, and believe it or not, there's not a ton of differences by party. 91% of democrats agree with it, but 67% of independents look like the country as a whole, half of rp rps think we need to do more to increase social justice. we start to ask more and should we be more tolerant of the lgbtq community? overall that's 61% and slightly less than the social justice number and here you see some divergence and democrats and independents both have majorities and we believe we should be more tolerant and republicans, an outlier just 38% and a lot of that driven by the trans issue of late and in pack, on the issue of trans people, have we gone too far in accepting trans people who in the country have agree with the the statement that we've gone too far. 48%. you start to look at it by party you see a disparity that goes the other way. just 19%, democrats believe

that, but independents look like the nation overall, nearly 80% of republicans believe we have gone too far on that, but i want to give you a historical nugget here to keep something in mind and it's the historical trend line of the legalization of same-sex marriage. less than 20 years ago it was two to one opposition to same-sex marriage and in less than 20 years those numbers completely flipped and something in the poll, if you knew somebody who was gay 20 years ago you were more likely to support same-sex marriage and if you know someone who is trans you are more likely to support that, as well. up next, gririevin foror

theyey'll be e here in 5,5,e reready? therere's uh.... oh. wewe'll just p put books h h. anand that looooks fine. ththat's bad. . there we g . ooo! thahat's no gooood. i can jujust cover i it. yeah. can n you do that the w whole day?? that wororks. - not t a big dealal. - i i can't stopop, i can't t . i dodon't have i it, i don'n't have it.t. leleft. left.. - kekeep going.. - eeyah.h. it's pererfect. we shoululd've used d behr. yeahah. today y let's papaint, spray, anand stain wiwith behr, america's s most trusted papaint brand.d. wawas the frididge here bebef? - yes. - no. behr. exclusivelely at the h home de. (v(vo) rered lobster'r's finer r poinf fun didining:

the correcect answer t to startr entreeee is - no. who giveves a shrimpmp, when yot bothth. introducucing new dodockside d. get anan individuaual-size star anand entree f for just $1$15.. welcome e to fun dinining. (cececily) yoyou're looooking pleasased h yourselflf. (s(seth) wewell, not toto brag, but i just switched my whole family to verizon. (cecily) oh, it's america's most reliable 5g network. (s(seth) anand it's s only $35 a a li. (neighbor) i got that deal too. (seth)h) oh heyey, braggingng buddies! (neighbobor) my m man! (cececily) ththis i don''t need.. (seth) you shouould give meme a cal! (vo) with vererizon, yourur family s the e network ththey can releln and d the disneyey bundle wih disnsney+, hulu,u, and espn+ inincluded. all l for just $ $35 a line. that's a savings of $240 a year. the e savings yoyou want. onon the netwowork worth b brag about. verizon welcome to the middle of everything! did you u know thatt ththe corn dogog was b born right hehere in illilinois? did you u know thatt ththe corn dogog was b born no j jane, i didid not know w . did you u know thatt ththe corn dogog was b born cheeeese! woohoo!! and d the music.c. we're baback when ololdies music was cacalled “newies.”

(gasps) bye bye! ha ha ho.o. ohoh, i'm scarared of h heights toooo, grandma. but then i i got tall!l! haha ha ha. ohoh, i'm scarared of h heights toooo, grandma. illinois,, the e middle of f everything! give y your small l business one tetech solutioion that checkcks all the e boxe. it''s all hehere with ththe comcmcast busineness complee connnnectivity s solution. peace ofof mind withth cybeberthreat sesecurity. the popower of thehe larges, faststest reliabable networ. plplus, save u up to 75% a ar with comomcast busininess mob. the cocomplete connectivivity solutioion. from t the companyny poweredy the nextxt generatioion 1010g network.k. get started for just $49 a momonth. and d ask about t an $8$800 prepaidid card. comcasast businessss. powewering possisibilities.

welcome back. at a crowded orioles game at camden yards, luke russert remembers his dad tim, going to a hot dog stand saying buddy, if we're ever separated, look for me there. when tim died of a heart attack in 2008, luke followed him to nbc news becoming a correspondent here. after working in television, luke didn't have a good question on why he was chasing his

father's legacy, he traveled to six continents sevening for his father and for himself and luke russert author" of look for me there," grieving my father and finding myself. welcome back to "meet the press". >> it is such an honor. i still get chills every time i see the logo and hear the music it's pretty special. >> i get chills introducing you right now, i'll be honest. >> yeah. >> you were 22 when your dad died. >> yeah. >> it seems that you're looking back now and realizing you didn't process it then. >> yeah. >> talk about it. >> well, he died and it was such a whirlwind of emotions and we came back to washington. my mother and i were in italy when it happened which turned out to be a blessing because we had one day to ourselves as a family, as mother and son to process what happened. >> he was with you two days before he passed away at the vatican which is so fitting considering my father's catholic

upbringing, but when we came back, we thought people would mourn him. we had no idea that there would be such a national outpouring of grief and there were thousands of people at his wake and i gave a eulogy at the kennedy center and it catapulted me into a very public forward-facing space that i was still trying to reconcile what should i do. >> weeks from graduating college? >> three weeks. >> i had graduated college and about three weeks later i'm looking out over a set of pews at barack obama, ethel cane and it was surreal. >> it is still surreal. >> i began thinking 22-year-old luke, you had so much courage and so much poise and you never dealt with you lost your dad and you lost your best friend and you went into which public-facing role because you were trying to preserve his legacy the best you knew and trying to bring comfort to people, but it ultimately did

not bring comfort to you. >> you wrote something they thought was pretty brave about yourself. you write this, it's apparent that i've spent so much time honoring his legacy that i've never truly accept his death and worse, i failed to honor my own life. that is a pretty brave thing to write publicly, buddy. >> one of the things that i found going through this process was i had written out all these journals when i was traveling around the world and i didn't know what was in them, but when i took the time to read them i realized i was looking for something, who am i independent of my parents? who am i independent of my hometown? who am i independent of the ways of washington, and i never was able to truly figure that out because i was so attached to dad, he was my guiding light. he's gone, and i try to stay in that lane, but i never really asked the difficult questions of who are you? what do you want to do? because it was greatly

uncomfortable and to ask those questions i would have to deal with the fact that he was really gone which was something i tried to power through and white knuckle and not power through too much. >> of all people it's john boehner. >> yeah. >> did he flip a switch in your head? what did he say to you that made you say, wait a minute? >> i was 30, and i had lost a good friend of mine at 27 and my father died at 58 and i saw the light at the end of my tunnel and friends were getting married and getting mortgages, is this what will happen to me in my life? is this what i want? there are so many days when i would white knuckle it through on television? why is that? maybe i should take time away and john boehner, who i covered aggressively said i need to talk to you. i thought he was going to be angry about coverage and he takes me into his office, what are you doing here? you invited me into your office, what do you mean what am i doing here? you spent all your 20s here. i'm the speaker of the house and

i'll tell you something, there is a world outside of washington. there is a world outside of this place, the capitol, time is a flat circle here. you can end up 50, 60 years old and not even know that time has gone by. make sure this is what you want to do and go out and do something else if you want. it's okay. go learn how to do something and part of it i think was that washington can be fleeting and the connections that you make with people can be purely political, go out there and really understand human beings and it was a very impactful statement because boehner grew up one of 12 children and catholic upbringing and very similar to my rust belt and worked his way through college and it didn't fall on deaf ears and i was shaken up by it. >> anyone who his lost anyone close to them, this is a book that can help. it is not easy about your mom. your mom is still here doing great. maureen is a force of nature. i love her to death, i know you

do, too. how's this changed things for you two? >> when one parent dies, your relationship with the surviving one for the child always changes. in my case you are sort of this man of the house and there were logistical things that dad used to also take care and sometimes, you're my son, just do it. so it was trying to navigate this pattern of where really are you in the structure? and also as a mom, she was more sort of the disciplinarian where my dad was the good cop/bad cop. he was the easier guy to get along with, and then i realized when i started traveling and my mother was a peace corps volunteer at a very young age when women had limited opportunities and she said i want to go to the peace corps and it is through travel and measuring yourself against the world that she really knows who she is and she'd wanted me to do that my entire life. i had never really traveled and i understood her, she had to fight so hard for everything she

got and that's why she demanded a lot out of me. she said you have to be tough and you need to find yourself. >> do you think you found yourself? >> i think we're always trying to do that, and in terms of making at peace with my dad, i am so much better. i hope this opportunities in that area. >> nice to see you. >> thank you for having me, chuck. it is such an honor. >>the honor is . give y your small l business one tetech solutioion that checkcks all the e boxe. it''s all hehere with ththe comcmcast busineness complee connnnectivity s solution. peace ofof mind withth cybeberthreat sesecurity. the popower of thehe larges, faststest reliabable networ.

plplus, save u up to 75% a ar with comomcast busininess mob. the cocomplete connectivivity solutioion. from t the companyny poweredy the nextxt generatioion 1010g network.k. get started for just $49 a momonth. and d ask about t an $8$800 prepaidid card. comcasast businessss. powewering possisibilities.